Starter Girlz Podcast

Leadership, Resilience, and Mentorship: Danielle Mikaelian's Journey from Columbia to Harvard

• Jennifer Loehding • Season 7 • Episode 69

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In this episode of the Starter Girlz podcast, host Jennifer Loehding interviews Danielle Mikaelian, a remarkable young woman in her final year at Harvard Law School. They discuss Danielle’s journey from Columbia University to Harvard, her leadership roles, and her passion for mentorship and empowering others. The conversation explores the importance of putting oneself out there, overcoming challenges, and how academic achievement can open doors to future opportunities.

Danielle shares her experiences in college admissions consulting and the significance of resilience in the face of rejection. They also discuss the challenges and triumphs of leadership, particularly during the pandemic, and highlight the importance of community engagement, cultural identity, and mentorship in giving back to future generations. The dialogue touches on personal interests, creative outlets, and the role of cultural exposure in shaping one's journey.

Takeaways

  • Proactivity is key in seeking opportunities and mentorship.
  • Academic achievement can open doors to future opportunities.
  • Resilience is essential in overcoming challenges and handling rejection.
  • Leadership roles foster growth but often come with adversity.
  • Mentorship plays a crucial role in guiding the next generation.
  • Community engagement and cultural identity shape personal development.
  • Life paths can evolve, and skills gained are transferable.

Welcome to the Starter Girls podcast, your ultimate source of inspiration and empowerment. We're here to help women succeed in every area of their lives, career, money, relationships, and health and well-being while celebrating the remarkable journeys of individuals from all walks of life who've achieved amazing things. Whether you're looking to supercharge your career, build financial independence, nurture meaningful relationships, or enhance your overall well-being. The Starter Girls podcast is here to guide you. Join us as we explore the journeys of those who dare to dream big and achieve greatness. I'm your host, Jennifer Loding, and welcome to this episode. Welcome another episode of the Starter Girls podcast. I am your host, Jennifer Loating, and wherever you are tuning in today, we are so thrilled to have you. And so let's talk a little bit about what's happening today. My guest is a dynamic, accomplished individual with an impressive journey through academia, leadership, and law. From her early days at Columbia University, where she was recognized as student of the year, to her current studies at Harvard Law, she has built a legacy of excellence, mentorship, and community impact. So you guys are going to be in for such an awesome treat today. I'm so excited to chat with her. She's a young college student, which I think is so fun to bring different people on here and hear her perspective and what she's pursuing and just all the amazing things she's done up to this point. And so you guys are going to get to hear from her in just a few minutes. But before we do that, I do need to do a quick shout out to our sponsor. This episode is brought to you by Walt Mills Productions. Need to add excitement to your YouTube videos or some expert hands for editing? Look no further. Walt Mills is the solution you've been searching for. Walt is not only your go-to guy for spicing up content, he's the force behind a thriving film production company with numerous titles in the pipeline. Always on the lookout for raw talent, Walt is eager to collaborate on film and internet productions. With a background deeply rooted in entertainment and promotion, Walt Mills leverages years of skills to give you the spotlight you deserve. Want to learn more about Walt and his work? Head on over to waltmillsproductions.net. and let your content shine. All right. And with that, Danielle McKellan is a Columbia University graduate, the BA in English Literature, and is now in her final year at Harvard Law School. She's held leadership roles in numerous organizations, served as an editor for multiple academic journals, and worked on legal projects spanning business, entertainment, and human rights. A published poet and dedicated mentor, she's also been recognized with prestigious scholarships and leadership awards, including the Miss J.D. Limitless Leadership Award, making her the only law student nationwide to receive this distinction in 2024. Passionate about law, mentorship, and empowering the next generation, she's set to embark on a career in transactional law in New York. So Danielle, welcome to the show. We are so excited to have you here and I'm excited to chat with you and learn about your journey. Thank you so much for having me. It's gonna be so much fun. So as I mentioned in the beginning, I just always have, I love it when young people come on a podcast because I think for a couple of reasons, because I think so many, not just your generation, but people as a whole have a fear of like talking, right? Like they have a fear of getting in front of people and speaking. And whenever I see young people actually emerging and doing those kinds of things, I get excited. And so for our guests, so you know, Danielle had actually reached out to me and asked to be a guest on the podcast. And I get, this is no lie, like every day I get multiple requests for people to come on this show. And most of these people are agents that are trying to find shows for their people. And so I look at those and I go, okay, well, I got another one. Here's another one. Here's another one. But when I get somebody that actually writes to me themselves and says, hey, I want to get on your show. Like those are the ones I want to read. Those are the ones that I want to talk to because They've taken the time to actually investigate and do the work and look to see, is this a show that I even have something to offer? And does it fit in the line with what I'm doing too? So Daniel, I wanna commend you on that. And I just wanted to share that with our audience so they know that, hey, you went out and you did this on your own. Nobody did this for you. And I love that about you. Thank you so much. I think it's good always being proactive and it never hurts to put yourself out there. You just have to be prepared for a positive or negative response, but if it's negative, you just move on from there and you continue your journey. And the thing is, is if you don't put yourself out there, you already have your answer, right? Like you already have to know. And so if you don't ask, you know, and, it's funny, like I said, because I get these requests every day and it's so funny. These people will write me a multiple. They'll be like in all my emails, they're in all of them, the same people. And I'm like, you know, like I'm seeing them everywhere and I just can't keep up. So anyways, I am so glad that we got to chat and we get to get you on here and talk about what you're doing because you have an impressive journey. And I think you're a remarkable. leader, mentor, and just a really great somebody for other young people to look up to and say, hey, look, there are amazing young people out here doing great things in the world and making a difference. Thank you, that's so kind. So awesome. All right, so let's talk about you. Let's talk about what is going on, because you are in your stretch here in law school. So tell us like what you're working on right now. What's happening in Danielle's world? So I am in my last semester of my studies at Harvard Law School. It has been a long journey to get here. I feel like I've been in school my entire life. And right now, I'm finishing up my classes and all the requirements to graduate. I'm cross-registered at Harvard Business School. I'm still actively involved on campus. One of my big roles is serving on the executive board of the Harvard Association for Law and Business, which is our law school business club, just because. I really do believe a lot of learning occurs outside of the classroom. And in that regard, I've always strived beyond my studies to be very proactive with campus leadership and to get involved in all these organizations. And then beyond that, you mentioned the award I won from Ms. JD. So I will be flying out to their gala in April in San Francisco to accept that award. I'm also going to Singapore with the Law School Business Club over spring break because we do an international truck every year to immerse ourselves in a more international community and gain a more globally minded sense of just businesses out there and opportunities out there. So that's been a great opportunity as well. I love it. Well, I want to back up just a little bit because I want to know if you've always been like this because I think that there are some people that are just really driven and focused and the infer to me, you seem extremely focused on what you need to get done. Like you look at something and you're like, I need to have this done kind of mindset. And I get that because I'm in a lot of ways I'm like that too. When I get hyper, not near as hyper, like not at your age, I was nowhere near like that. But I will tell you now as a grownup, I feel like when I get hyper-focused on something, I'm like, no, this has to be done. I got to get it done. And I get very frustrated when I don't. So I'd love to back this up a little bit. Tell me, were you like this, when you came out of mom's womb, like from day one, just always had this discipline and determination? I've always been fairly determined and I've been a go-getter. I will say when I was really young, I think I was a little more introverted. I was that elementary schooler that just adored reading and would actually prefer reading to people. I kind of make that joke because when I was in elementary school, I would read under my desk. That's how much I loved reading. And that love of reading never faded. just, again, started to prefer people more. and became an extrovert over time and ended up using that level of reading to major in English at Columbia so many years later. But I've always been at the top of my class academically. I've always been very driven. I was a middle school valedictorian, a high school valedictorian and all of those things. So I think I have always had very high goals for myself. And I just recognize certain sacrifices have to be made along the way to get there. And for me, academic achievement was my way of opening these opportunities and it worked out over time, right? Because I was a public school student that really had no real thought that I would end up at two Ivy League schools. This has solely occurred just as a result of merit and drive, so. Yeah, I love it, Daniel. I think it's awesome. Now, are you, do you have siblings? I do have two siblings. I have two younger brothers who are identical twins. Okay, so you are the oldest. you kind of I hate I don't like to ever say somebody reminds me so you sort of kind of remind me my oldest daughter a little bit. She was always she so I have three kids too and my oldest is she's now 29 and she's actually just got her first job as a bilingual fourth grade teacher. She's completely fluent in Spanish. Nobody in our house spoke Spanish. There's not a bit of Spanish heritage in my family, but she was always a from very early age was always reading. In fact, I have this story that I tell it. We were in the bank line. She was four years old and I had put her in a like, was kind of like a monastery type school. I had a girlfriend and her daughter was going there at the time. So we decided to put the girls in together. I had no idea that Kara was reading as early as she was. And one day we were sitting in the drive-through at the bank and I'm making, putting money in the bank and she's in the back seat with my then, my middle child who's now 24. She was a baby and Kara was reading a book to her. And I stopped and I said, Are you reading that? And so I remember pulling the book back and like flipping the paper and say, tell me what that says. And she started reading to me the book. I had no idea this kid could even read at this age, but they had been teaching them the alphabet and how to read. And they had done these whole letter books and everything. And so she has always been that, that kid reader, like just always loved still to this day loves reading. And the funny thing was when she went to college, she kind of took a detour. She went to UNT, a scholarship, and then she dropped out, got married, and then all of a sudden she comes to me one day and she's like, I'm going back to school to finish my degree. And she finished her two years in education in like six months. Like seriously, within six months to a year, finished her testing, did everything, went and took the state testing, and now we're mid-year and the school year and she just got her first job as a bilingual teacher, you know? And so you just kind of, when you're telling me about these academia things, y'all are completely different. I'm not diminishing, you've done incredible things, but I... That's what I was asking. Are you a first born? Like I wanted to know where you were in this because I see a lot of like just similarities in the drive and that, yeah, that determination. And I love it. I think it's great. So kudos to you. Thank you so much. And I know we haven't touched upon this yet, but I think really working so hard throughout my life and having those opportunities and seeing where they've been able to get me is one of the reasons why I ended up doing college admissions consulting work. So for anyone tuning in, I've been working in the college admissions space for the last eight years. And I began the year I started at Columbia University just because For me, that's my way of opening those doors for the people that come after me. whether it's improving an essay or helping someone secure an internship or just giving general advice, those college opportunities are really defining your future and what opportunities you're going to have post-grad and down the line. Yeah, I agree. Let's talk about that a little bit, because that's obviously an area that you're you're well versed in and you're doing it and you're passionate about it. It's funny when I do these shows, you know, I always can tell kind of what the area is, like what is it that people are really driven to? And you have so many things you're doing, but I know this is a big area for you. So tell us a little bit about this. Is this position like these kids are coming in? Are you seeking them out? They coming to you? How does this all work for you? I've worked in a variety of different roles. had happened was originally when I was at Columbia, I started turning to online forums like Reddit to find people who needed this type of help and insight. And this is in addition to my own personal mentorship efforts throughout the years, I've just helped a lot of people on the side. And that's just me genuinely offering my time. Often those are members of the Armenian community. I'm ethnically Armenian and We just haven't had much representation as a minority group at top schools. So it's been really important to me as someone who's managed to achieve that, to give back to my own community. But I started on Reddit, started editing essays, all these different things. And then upon graduating from Columbia, I took one gap year. It was during the heart of COVID. So in-person opportunities were a little more limited than when I actually began working for Almost 10 different companies as an independent contractor and they were all in the education consulting space. So I was doing everything from teaching international students about the different colleges and how to make that transition through webinars to acting as a writing coach for students in China. And helping students in Romania through a different company. And then one of the companies that I really, really enjoyed was A college consulting company based in the US. They're based in San Francisco and this company has just done amazing. They have like 20 million in venture capital funding. It's a very tech enabled platform where students can send in essays and get feedback from a member of our team within 24 hours. So you it's not just working with a counselor. You also have like this additional support the additional resources and I enjoyed working with them so much that. I actually started my studies at Harvard Law School and continued to work for them part time and I'm doing that to this day. That's awesome. Good for you. And you're so busy. I love it. You're just a busy girl. can't get in trouble when you're busy, right? Keeps you focused and grounded. That's what I always tell my kids. If you're too busy to do it in trouble, you just stay busy. I love it, Danielle. I love it. So I had another question and then I dropped it. My brain went frozen and it does that sometimes when we're on these shows. That's what I love about podcasting is that we can just chit chat. We don't have to worry about being perfect all the time, right? Like if you do everything live, you always feel like you gotta have it all perfect. When we do this, it's great. We get to relax a little bit. So cool stuff. So you're gonna be finishing up here and then you're gonna go into transactional wall. Did I get that correct when I introduced that? Yes, so coming into law school, I'm the first to be lawyer in my extended family, so I really had to figure out what path I was going to be pursuing. And in that regard, one of the things I did as a first year was one of the most difficult positions you can get as a first year summer as a law student is a position at a big corporate law firm. And it's pretty much unheard of there. Definitely are positions, but they're just very competitive. So I basically applied to every single firm in New York. And then beyond that, I applied to additional opportunities across the country. had like a very clear list and I would just write down applied to this one applied to this one. And these are the ones I have to still apply to. And I would just keep going through that list and marking off the names. And somehow fairly late in the process, I received a call. from a New York law firm saying, we're going to give you this opportunity. that was my first exposure to the type of law firm I'm now going to, but I felt very privileged to have that opportunity as a first year. And again, it's that general mentality, put yourself out there, at least try. You never know if you don't try. It only takes one. And I decided to go to a different firm my second year summer, really enjoyed it there. And I'm now headed back to that same firm. after graduation. Well, and there's something to be said about this. mean, talking just about this, putting yourself out there because you know, they, don't know where I saw this, but they were talking about how like when women go to apply for a job, if they're missing any of the qualifications, like they won't apply and men will just apply. If they think that I got some of them, they'll go apply for the job, right? And so I think there's something to be said about this because I'm thinking about like how you went to all of these different companies and just put that, put yourself out there and you, you made, you were vulnerable. and you put yourself out to say, I may get told no, but maybe somebody is going to say yes in there, right? There are so many people who never, if you think about this, or just won't put themselves out in these positions because they're afraid of that no, right? Like they're afraid of that, of that. And I got this thing flying, like a bug flying in front of me, like get out of here. Like they're just afraid to put themselves out there to get that possible no. And I like that you're just like, you're saying, okay, I'm not gonna put all my eggs in one basket. I'm just gonna go out there and do a lot and see what comes back. Absolutely. I love it. I love it. Anything so, and I would love maybe for somebody listening to this because some young person may get ahold of this and be like, okay, this girl's just, you know, discipline got it going on. And clearly you've had setbacks. We all do. That's just a life. If you have it, they're coming, right? I would say they're always around the corner. What have been, you feel like maybe some of the challenges for you, you know, trying to pursue this, is it just been like, you know, staying focused or is it, have there been some blocks that have come up for you? I definitely think with my type of approach, you have to always be anticipating rejection. And I definitely have experienced probably more rejection than the average person as a result. And I think often the other thing that you encounter when you're in leadership roles is you also end up in more difficult situations as a whole than you might face otherwise, whether that's just like. interpersonal with other individuals you're working with or so on. Yes. Some of my friends have joked that I can be a drama magnet just because they're like, how did you end up in this situation with this club or organization? then they're like, well, wait, this makes total sense. You're the one putting yourself out there more than anyone. You're being exposed to more situations where if 90 % of them are perfect, then there's going to be the 10 % that aren't. And Along those lines, when I started my studies at Harvard Law School were placed into sections for the entire first year. So I took all my classes with the same group of 80 people and we had superlatives at the very end. And I received the designation of most involved and I was here like, okay, I'm being deemed most involved at Harvard Law School. Is that a positive or is that a negative? Right. I don't know if this is a compliment or not, but I think. It's a combination of just one rejection and then you encounter all these messy situations with clubs and organizations just as a result of the groups of people working together. Maybe people disagree on an issue or so on and it's just I really believe in ethical leadership and just making sure all sides are heard trying to reach a compromise, but it can sometimes be hard to get there. Yeah, well, and you kind of, you know, what's that saying? Hit the nail on the head when you said the more the more you're putting yourself out there, the more you're going to be subjected to using interpersonal skills. You're going to be in places where you're dealing with people coming from all different angles. And I would imagine, you know, this is it's I think it's a gift. When you were talking about, you know, trying to let all people be heard and find an amicable, I don't know what the exact word you said, but finding solutions, right, which is what we like to do. It makes me think of Stephen Covey's book The seven habits of highly effective people. don't know you read it, but he talks about in there. always tell young people to read it. It's a really good book. It really, one of the chapters in there, he talks about the win-win and he uses, there's a video. You can actually look it up online, but he uses a video. It's an old, mean, like this is an old thing where he spoke at this guy's not even alive anymore, but he pulled a guy up on stage and they were going to do like, they were standing up they were going do like an arm wrestle. And he says, okay, we're going to do an arm wrestle. And so the guy gets ready to do it and he just folds his arm. And the guy's like, what the heck? And so then the guy goes back that way. And then so they keep, ultimately they keep doing this. And the whole point of this lesson was that when you give, other people are willing to give. Like, so, right, it's the give and take instead of buckling down and trying to fight, you you learn to find a win-win situation. Does that happen every single time in life? No, but when people get to be heard, when all people are having a perspective and everybody and people are listening, you have less resistance. Going back and forth so listening to you talk about that, but then also just putting yourself into those leadership roles where yes, you are going to be subjected to more situations where you're to have adversity and I kind of I always feel like I don't I'm doing anything like you, but I people have told me that too that I attract that kind of stuff too and it's because whenever I'm in a situation, I always want to try to find the wind. I want to try to figure out how to. Let everybody, even if we don't agree on everything, everybody at least walk away not hating each other at the end of that conversation, which is what happens in a lot of cases, right? Definitely. And you just never know what will happen, right? I mean, especially with college and law school organizations, it can be messy. And then I will say I did graduate during the pandemic as well, which I think has also been a huge hurdle for my generation. I lost the last bit of my junior year of college, my entire senior year, and then spent the next year basically at home doing law school apps and all of these remote roles. But it's not the same as being able to graduate. normally have a normal graduation, have all these senior traditions, and then go into the workforce. Right, right. And you've done remarkable despite that because yeah, it was a tough time for, know, talk about the people outside, but yes, for the students, you know, both in high schools and regular, you know, in the K through 12, but also in the college. I mean, I had one kind of like you in the middle of that, that was off at college and everything, just the whole world froze and they lost, she was a cross country student, track student. So they shut everything down. That was kind of their lifeline, you know, like that's why she went to school was to run. You know, she didn't care about schools. She just wanted to be a runner, you know, and so anyways, but yeah, you've done remarkable despite that. So I think it's incredible the work that you're doing and and just in the leadership space. I think you're a good role model for other students looking to either, you know, go into that space or that are currently in it right now. So I love it. Good stuff. Thank you. So community service work. I know you do some of that didn't didn't I read you had a nonprofit or something? Did I read that you did something? few things along those lines. mean, for one, I mentioned I really do believe in giving back, especially to members of my ethnic group. So when I was at Columbia, I had launched a nonprofit initiative where I actually, at the time I was serving as Armenian club president at Columbia and we actually had other Armenian societies across the country get involved and we were having Armenian students send their essays and resumes and all these different things and just giving them feedback on those materials. for free. the college of Missing A. that help and support just because at any school I've been to, I'm one if not two of the Armenian students in my year and we are a very small group, but it would be really nice to have more people like me represented just because I think as an ethnic group, we have a really unique past and history and culture, especially comes to things like the Armenian genocide and how that influences just our like perception of society today. So. Yeah, I know that's interesting and actually I interviewed another Armenian. He said he's a he's an adult now, but here's the funny thing about him. He has this crazy story. I feel like you need to listen to his episode because he has this crazy story where he fled home at like 17 because they I think he was going to go to the military or something and he left and he tells this story about how he had to hide out and then he ended up here and he got a mentor when he came to the States. And I can't remember like what happened in between, but then he went to California and started working there, met his wife. They live here now in Dallas, but they now have like a mental, it's like they help families is what they do. They're like counselors. They have a whole counseling thing now where they help. The lady had gone into like something in California where she was working in the system with kids that were being like from broken homes or something. And so their whole mission is to help keep families together. And so they have a practice here, but he had such, I told him, you need to write a book. I'm like, you need to write a book. was such a neat guy. His name's Rafi. need you like, need to share his story with you so you can hear it because you guys are such a small community and he has this, like what you're talking about, the heritage. He has a really crazy story of like hiding out in the forest and like to get here and yeah. And he's older now. So he's like my age. He's got little kids and stuff, but. He did all this when he was young, like, I think 17 or eight, somewhere around there, right out of high school. That's great. Being Armenian has been a big part of my journey as well. What I will say is there's been a few different like cultural organizations every single time I've moved. It's been a community that's ready to welcome me and I really don't take that for granted because it's nice when you move somewhere you've never been to before having a community beyond school. And I made a real leap when I was 17. I grew up in a pretty small California suburb or at least quiet California suburb. And I had been to New York one day in my life to tour Columbia University and really made that leap of, okay, I'm going to go here, move across the country and basically go to the most hustling bustling city on the planet. Right. And it was definitely a huge adjustment. I had no idea what I was getting into, but I experienced so much self growth as a result of that leap. And. Because of it, I really do encourage students if they can to try to go to school outside of state. I know that people have family circumstances and so on where they can't do that. But I do think going outside that comfort zone was a huge aspect of my journey and really helped me become more familiar with New York City corporations and just become a lot more globally minded in general because Columbia has the second highest international student body. in the United States. one out of every five undergraduate students is from abroad. And many of my friends to this day did not grow up in the United States. And for someone again, who was from a California suburb, that was just such a shock to me. I'm like, Whoa, I'm learning so much about the world just through my daily interactions with these people. And then now I get wedding invites in India and so on. Yeah, that's fun. No, and I agree. mean, you're going, yeah, West Coast, East Coast, very different sides of the world. But no, I do think it's I think I, you know, my middle child likes to travel and I and I'm a big my little one went to Australia or my oldest went to Australia when she was like 11 or 12. And I've always even when they were in school, they were in a charter school. So they were around different cultures all the time growing up. And lot of their friends are different from them. And I think it's great when you get exposure because you do get to see other things and learn. And just going within the United States, yes, you can move around and it's very culturally different. You know, basically, like we said, the East Coast, West Coast, the South. I mean, you've got very different things going on in all of the different places. So I can imagine that, yeah, just making that shift, you know, in the beginning was like, wow, okay, it's different here. It's hustling and bustling and moving and, you know, I've never personally been to New York. My son was wanting to go there. He was on a work trip. Well, you know, after he graduated, he got to travel a little bit. That was one of the places they were going to get to go and then they reroute and he was so disappointed because he didn't get to go to New York. So yeah, I think you know if you get an opportunity to be, you know, get culturally aware and do some different things, I think yeah, you should take it and it's it's a good growing thing. You need to make it out to New York though. I will say it is my favorite city and for that reason I am going back after graduation, but I've just grown to love New York. I think that there's no other city like it where you can just be on the subway and start talking to the most interesting people. And I really think New Yorkers have a rep because I think that people are actually very friendly and very willing to strike up conversations. And there's always different events going on. You're never bored in New York, right? There's always something to do and something going on. Well, it's funny, you know, because people here all the time ask me if I'm from East Coast, like the last time, are you from New York or New Jersey? I'm like, no, I have family that's East Coast, but I have lived in Texas my entire life. I think Texas is good. And I grew up in Houston in the city. think it's a melting pot. So you got a lot of people there too. But I always get asked that question because I'm direct and I'm I'm taught fast and I move fast. But I think mostly it's just because I'm direct. I'm like, I love that. I mean, meet New York people. I always have a fun time with them because they are their direct. just say what they got to say, which is good. I for me, it's great because you don't have any ambiguity that way. You don't have to like read people's minds and do telepathy and all that stuff. You know, it's like they just tell you so. But no, I'm glad you're enjoying it and that you're thriving there. I think it's awesome that you're getting, you know, the opportunity. But you know, you've done the work and I think that's the point here is that you didn't just waltz into this. You've done the work all the way up to the places that you've been now and. You're being able to take the reward that's come from that, from all your discipline and dedication. Absolutely. It's definitely started to pay off. mean, I am at a very early stage of my journey though, right? Because I haven't worked a full-time job yet. So we're starting that new journey starting next fall, but it has been a long time coming. It's really interesting looking at how many years of just kind of grinding it's taken to get to this point. be fun to see what you do as you keep growing and like we're gonna hear about you one day in something you have some big case you're working on or something big that you're doing. Be like, we knew that girl when she was back in school and she was finishing up her law degree and doing all those things, but you're definitely, mean, your track record is just remarkable. So I expect that you're gonna continue to do the same cycle of, know, make different things in the world, right? Like not the same things, but you're gonna continue to be. doing amazing things and making a difference in your community and in your, you know, your cultural stuff and all of that. So I'm excited to, you know, kind of see where you go with all of this. Definitely. And I think in that regard, even though I have been able to make it this far and I'm grateful for the opportunities, one of my major takeaways is you also want to be taking enough time to give back to the next generation. And I really do make a point of that. And I think that's actually very unique for someone, at least at Harvard Law School. don't know that many students who do it. I know of a few. but I really take the time to mentor younger students. And I actually speak to undergraduate pre-law clubs across the country, just trying to provide any application advice, answer any questions, just because as someone who did go into college, like how do I get into law school? How does this work? I know having one hour with someone who knows the process well and can tell you the main things makes such a difference, especially in an area like law school admissions, which it's very GPA oriented and a lot of students don't recognize that to the extent they're like, I'm an engineer. They'll understand if my GPA is lower. Not really. So having someone tell you early enough, no, you need that GPA to be high. It just needs to be a high number. Little tweaks like that early on in the process can be game changing for someone. Yeah, and that's good advice, by the way. So thank you for sharing that. Because my question was going to be, what advice would you be giving these young people? Let's say somebody coming out right now in high school, and they're like, OK, I'm going to get into college. What do I need to do? Anything you want to lend them other than GPA matters, you need to that. Keep talking about your GPA. So for undergraduate admissions, it's a little more holistic. So in that regard, yes, you want the GPA, you want the SAT, ACT score, but you really want a strong track record of involvement as well as a strong narrative. So I always tell the students that I'm consulting, the first thing you want to do as a high school student trying to get into college is you pick what major you're applying with and you can change that later. You can change it after you gain admission to the school, but we need to pick a major because you are going to then take the rest of your high school journey supporting that major and showing how you're dedicated to it. And then ultimately when you apply in there, like, why do you want to be a math major? I've done all these math competitions. I'm president of math club and so on. But unfortunately, we don't live in a day and age where being undecided is favored by admissions committees. You can be undecided. I know how hard it is to pick a life path, but at least for the admissions process, you want to really hone in, focus on an area, say you're dedicated to it, and then take it from there. Yeah, I know that's good. And I was laughing your life path. Yeah, because you know, it's funny. I was talking, I was interviewing an attorney. I maybe shared this with you a few weeks ago. She was a like a federal trade like she was in the same kind of maybe what you're kind of go. She was a litigator, but she was with the United Nations in the US and some kind of federal trade thing or something anyways, neat lady. But she she was in. She's an ADHD. She has ADHD and so she said that one of the things that was crazy for her is because she. would go back and she'd have to spend hours reading these documents. And she said, my ADHD brain would go nuts reading all these documents. And I want to caveat this and say she did not, she wasn't a fast talker. She wasn't like all over the place in her dialogue. So you wouldn't have had any idea listening to her talk that she had ADHD, but she said, reading those documents made her crazy. And so she left, you know, that's what she went to school for, did the work and did, had an impressive career. and then left that to become a basically a coach, an ADHD coach and work with people. She said that what she started finding is in her practice, she really enjoyed the mentoring. She enjoyed coaching and mentoring people. And so her path kind of shifted. And so I think the beautiful thing about this is yes, I think we get so set that, and I'm telling you this now because I went to school for something different. went into accounting and I do not do accounting. I'm not gonna touch accounting. because the idea of me sitting down and doing people's numbers all day would make me absolutely nuts at this stage of my life. But we have to pick a path, right? We had to pick a path. And the beautiful thing is what I will say about this is even whatever you study, even if down the road your path changes a little bit, all the life skills and all the knowledge you gained in the path that you were in will help you carry you into whatever you continue to do forward. So if at some point you go down the road and you're like... You know what I'm done being attorney and I want to go into some kind of community work like get community service or something. Your leadership skills. Everything you learned in that area of law are going to help you into that path, just as importantly as they're doing right now. And so I believe there are no wrong paths. I think you know, I think we just have to pick something that we feel passionate about. And yes, go into that area and do it. And if you love it, stick with it. But your life evolves and as we age we. our desires change, you know, and our lives evolve. And that's the beautiful thing about this world and life that we get to live. We get to do that. Definitely. I will say I have loved that mentorship aspect and it's really rewarding knowing that people are attributing a portion of their college journey to you. I get some very lovely messages from my students who are very excited after gaining admission somewhere and it's just, it's really heartwarming. Yeah. Right. And, they'll hopefully they don't forget me. mean, maybe they do. That's fine. You know, they go. off to college and it is what it is, but I've also just been able to meet so many different people through that type of career and being connected to so many different clients and their families. And it's really rewarding as well, being able to help eliminate a little bit of the stress because my generation has it rough when it comes to just all the pressure that's being put on you. I would know it firsthand, just as someone who has these like high up goals and has been striving for years to reach where I am right now, but it's hard, right? And so we have to give ourself some grace and then if we can be there for others, why not? Exactly. I agree and I think it's good. Okay, so one fun question I want to ask you when you're not doing studies and I have a feeling you're going to tell me you're what you're doing because I think you love what you do. But when you're not doing studies school, all those things, what does Daniel like to do for fun? Besides maybe reading anything else? I mainly just love hanging out with friends and exploring new cities. I've been to a lot of the major cities across the US. So this year alone, I went to Nashville for the first time. I went to Miami for the first time. And I really, again, do value those experiences where you're exposing yourself to more of the world, even if it's just in the US. So I think exploring different cities is a big one. Yeah. And then beyond that, I think it's just I do write poetry on the side. I would say that's another one, like having that type of creative pursuit. So I've been writing on the side for years, whether it's just articles for different Armenian news outlets or the poetry side. I actually was in a few creative writing workshops at Columbia and took it from there. I was part of a poetry mentorship program this past fall. And it was nice because I was able to get feedback on a few pieces. Which, again, I don't think I'm going to be a professional poet or anything, but it's a fun little side hobby. And you need that. You definitely need that. You need to have creativity. It helps you in what you're doing. It'll help you in law. That's a beautiful thing. I I tell people all the time, even though you have this serious thing going on over here, you need some kind of creative outlet as well because creative expression really helps with ingenuity and industriousness and all the things that you need in the analytical side of your brain. So definitely, I think it's great. I love it. So Danielle, this has been awesome. I think you're doing some great stuff. I'm going to keep in touch with you so I can keep up with what you're doing. And I'm sure a lot of those people that you've helped are going to remember you. They're always going to remember that. That person helped me get into college or told me some things I needed to know. So I want to commend you on that. Let's say somebody listening to this wants to reach out to you. Maybe there's a parent that says, hey, I want my kid to hear this and listen to this story. And then this girl's or dude says, hey, I want to get in touch with this Danielle and find out what she's got going on. Where do send it? Where do you want us to send them to? So they are welcome to contact me on LinkedIn. It's just my full name as seen on this podcast. Or you could email me. I will say my email is a little bit complicated. I blame Harvard Law for that. But it's dmichaelian at JD25.law.harvard.edu. wish that was shorter, but don't It's like the school, they always have like long names, don't they make them so complicated? We'll make sure that when this gets in there, I'm gonna connect with you in LinkedIn, but we'll make sure that when this gets connected, we put some links in there so people know how to reach out to you. Okay, sounds great. So thank you, Danielle, you are awesome. Keep doing your thing. I'm like, I'm out there coughing. I'm like, no coughing. Keep doing your thing and we appreciate you, your time, all the good stuff today. Absolutely and thank you again for having me on. This was a pleasure and I really enjoyed speaking. to our audience. If you found this episode informative and inspiring, we hope you did. Do all the things, hit the share, like, comment, and get it out there so we can keep sharing all this fabulous content. And as I always say, in order to live the extraordinary, you must start, and every start begins with a decision. You guys take care, be safe, be kind to one another, and we will see you next time.

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